Naruki no baka na hanashi

But they need to consult a dictionary.

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the little fellow looks everything else but ;-). Will have to check on mine, I guess. Is that the US only? Or worldwide? Disgusting. I am constantly absolutely abhorred to see what women are willing to put up with. I mean - surely the guy didn't turn nasty when she got pregnant, only. Nastier, possibly. But: It is one thing if you want to let yourself be abused. Having children in such a relationship - well, as I said...

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that enable me to appreciate NOLAWitch's point of view, even though I reject it in the general case.

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Well, I don't, to be honest. I have never felt any urge to "multiply" :-). On the other hand: Two of my cousins will have their first kids this month - and I feel glad for them. They have waited a long time, have tried a lot, and are now so very happy that I just don't find it in me to act the old cynic - at least not in their faces :-). Both stable, good relationships, though, and rather mature people.

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She is of the opinion that nobody should have kids. That everyone is "just being selfish" to do that.

I'm usually wary of absolute extremes.

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...that she is talking to/about those of us who have a choice, that is those who live in a "civilized" society where you actually have kids as a lifestyle-asset and not as a pension plan or to work your fields...
My bad. "Assuming" must sound a bit irrational to you, I guess. But there are messages between lines, for me :-). Of course, "absolute extremes" are never a good idea. But for the sake of an argument, they sure come in handy...(I am working on getting rid of some in my own preachings, by the way.)

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We make reasonable assumptions all the time. Like assuming that we don't have to cower in a basement to avoid alien mind control rays. We _could_ be wrong, but it's _reasonable_ to assume we are safe from that.

It's when people make unreasonable assumptions that they behave stupidly.

Your assumption seems quite reasonable.

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Thank you, Master ;-)! No, seriously. Now I only have to find the thin line between reasonable and unreasonable again *sigh*... Another field where emotions tend to be a hindrance, time and again :-).

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thewrongcrowd.livejournal.com

in her argument. She's usually ripping someone a new one for arguing that having kids is a benefit to society. I've always gotten the sense that she just wants them to admit that they spawned for their own needs and wants and weren't doing her any favors.

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I'm reminded of a time my dad gave me some letters to put in the "LOCAL DELIVERY" slot at the post office. I saw the "NON-LOCAL DELIVERY" sign and put them in that one instead. I didn't know that "NON" meant the opposite.

Maybe the person who made the icon just pinged on the word they knew, "animate," and didn't notice the "ex."

I was only three or four, so I had an excuse. :)

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niwikki.livejournal.com

you didn't know that? I thought it was common knowledge.

Then again, I'm living in the state that's been obsessed with the Laci/Scott Peterson trial for the last year or so...

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ms-issicran.livejournal.com

if there's a correlation between this fact and the recent trend among young women to use pregnancy to trap a man. I understand its becoming very common. Saminz, I believe its only true for those of us in the U.S.. I thought it was common knowledge too. At what point do we parents accept that we didn't raise our children well, or, what the hell is happening to our kids? Its like the unwanted pet syndrome. Don't want it? Drop it at the pound, or leave it by the road. Don't want that family responsibility? Take them to the woods and kill them, or beat them to death and dump them in the water. WTF?

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plblark.livejournal.com

It seems to me that some People put more thought into what system to buy and options on their Value meal than the decision and responsibilities of having a child. But then when the package is delivered and it's time to put up or shut up, they can't bring themselves to take responsibility for their actions.

I lay a lot of today's problems on the parents of the current generation. Relaxing of standards, Finding excuses for poor timmy and why it wasn't his fault. Tolerant parents making excuses for their rejects and society re-defining its expectations! I lay a lot of my fears for the future on the current crop of parents. I heard a couple kids talking about playing Grand Theft Auto the other day... Laughing about the levels of realism and violence... WTF? Who allows their children to HAVE these games? Maybe it's only natural to look back and think things were so much better when I was a kid. But the rampant "Not-me" mentality and un-involved parents makes me sick.

ms_issicran makes an uncomfortable but very good point in linking the pregnancy trap to this issue. Given the number of young parents I see and toughened child support laws, it's no longer as easy to just walk away, so the next obviousl step is murer? WHAT THE HECK IS WRONG WITH PEOPLE!

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Be a correlation. These girls really are - I can't begin to tell you how disgusted I am with such behavior. That is not only "selfish". That is disastrous. WTF indeed...

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ajollypyruvate

How are you defining "recent"? It was a "trend" in the 70s, 80s, and 90s.

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thewrongcrowd.livejournal.com

The term 'shotgun wedding' ring any bells?

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ms-issicran.livejournal.com

You're right, it was, and the term shotgun wedding was still used in the 70's too. I don't know if it carried to the 80's and on or not.

I was going by my impression of a snippet of newscast where the talking heads were plugging THEIR station's morning show following the news broadcast. I remember a clip of about 6 women, three older, three young. The young ones were expressing an occurrence differently than a shotgun wedding, or a young woman caught in a bad situation trying to make the guy 'do the right thing'.

It was described more like a competitive sport. Girls who seem pretty self satisfied in their arrogant and aggresive ability to get a man no matter what - they want him, they get him by whatever means. It didn't seem like love had too much to do with it. Sure didn't sound like they had any intention of nurturing the relationship, only accomplishing the self gratification of what they wanted immediately, or what they could keep another girl from getting.

It just seemed odd and messed up and most likely what old people have felt about the way young people are down through the ages. Why does it seem so unfixably drastic now that I'M getting old?

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spud31.livejournal.com

That's really sobering. :-(

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If you recall or run across a source for that, I would be interested. Not because I don't believe it--I do--but because I like to read the stats for myself before passing them to a third party. And something like this is something I would mention.

I Googled a bit and found other statistics, which I was already aware of. That homicide is one of the top causes of death for young women, pregnant or not. That a very disturbing number of murdered women were killed by a male family member.

But I had no idea that if you just counted women who were killed by their significan others, it would still be the leading cause of death among pregnant women and new mothers. That is depressing and horrible.

Eminem did a song where he was rapping to his baby daughter about killing her mother and dumping the body in the lake. And he's not ostracized for it. That's just sick.

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Once my ex-stepfather slapped my mom, and she called the police. Do you know what the fucking bastards said when they got there? "A man has the right to do what he wants in his own home."

I heard it myself, hiding on the stairs, or I never would have believed it. This was in a small town, just large enough to be technically called a city, in upstate New York.

Fortunately Mom eventually divorced the asshole. He was always quoting the Apostle Paul to back up his misogynistic views (ah, the day when I yelled Paul was a stupid chauvinist pig! at him...a fond memory).

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Here, since a year or two, an abusive male will be the one that has to leave the house/apartment. He gets a court order not to go back and/or bother his family for at least 10 days. Not much, but it can give the woman some breath and maybe encourage her to leave him in an orderly way. Before, the only option she had was to run away to a shelter (of which there are always desperately too few) with her kids. Bravo, you. I trust you to go on yelling "chauvinist pig" as often as necessary :-)!

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thenea.livejournal.com

I really wonder what is the point of laws and civilization when crap like this still goes on so much that it's #1.

More reasons to become a hermit are brought to my attention every day.

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Well - not necessarily. I have known guys as easy friends, fun to be with, clever, well liked by everyone, until seeing them with their SO. It seems that some men will only treat "their" woman bad, while being absolutely civil to everyone else... All you need to be is single, actually. Or, at least, run, fast, as soon as someone starts calling you the "one and only". Cynical? Yes. But I am talking from experience. Not violence, no. But pathological jealousy and a generally difficult private life ;-).

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thenea.livejournal.com

Have been for a couple years now, but that's not the issue. (I've never had a problem with the guys I've dated and I'm still friends with many of them.) It's the fact that I don't really want a society that doesn't shut down violence against women (or anyone one for that matter) pretty strenuously, that has sections that encourage women to get pregant as a solution to all their relationship problems, and where no one is surprised that homocide is the #1 cause of death for new mothers and pregnant women.

To get away from society one must become a hermit.

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To get away from society, yes, you would have to become a hermit. But society - at least in your little corner - can become a little less disgusting if you stick around... I guess we all do that. Create a Niche where we can feel accepted and safe for a little while, even when the whole world "out there" seems a madhouse - as it certainly seems, at the moment, with the election... Do I make sense? See, if all well meaning folks take to the caves - who will be there to help if or when there finally is a chance to make a difference?! I can't seem to grow out of a certain idealism. And I don't want to be the only one...

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Yes, but Naruki said "homicide by significant others."

If true, that means more pregnant women & new moms get killed by boyfriends or spouses, than die from ANY other single cause.

"Homicide" being their #1 cause of death is sad but not surprising. "Homicide by S.O." being able to take the #1 spot as its own category is awful.

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Probably Naruki has found a master here in putting logic over "emotions" :-). I have actually waited for someone to point out that it was all thanks to Mister Semmelweis, otherwise, these women would have died in childbed anyway...

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Really. I do see, no problem. I was just trying to tease you. No luck, obviously ;-). That's what fascinates me with you guys. Different brain waves altogether. You are certainly right. But I just can't keep myself thinking in crystal paths of logic when hearing something like this - and I am not alone, I guess. Takes all kinds, right ;-)? Seriously. No offense meant. I am learning to be a little more rational, anyway. Promised.

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